Comments on: Dr Jiang’s thoughts on treating the exterior

By: Alasdair

Alasdair — Tue, 08 Nov 2011 10:54:10 +0000

Interesting, it would be useful to know what the strength ratio (fresh to granules) was. Most granules are 6:1 so he would have been giving you the equivalent of an 18-20g fresh prescription per day even at 10:1 still only 30 – 40g. Given that it was a combination of 4 classic formulae and 7 other herbs you would have been taking almost microscopic dosages of some herbs. Wild!! Shame that the good doctor has died. I hope that someone has inherited the knowledge. He must have been a diagnostician of the first order. I suspect his way of thinking could be applied to the construction of single formulae, sounds like pre-communist classical TCM working with the body, rather than beating the disease into submission.

By: Michael Max

Michael Max — Fri, 28 Oct 2011 16:10:47 +0000

Mike-
Sorry to say that Doctor Jiang passed away last winter. He was well over 100 years old.

By: Mike Mathers

Mike Mathers — Fri, 28 Oct 2011 04:00:37 +0000

Hi Michael,

I’m in Taiwan at the moment and would love to go see Dr. Jiang while I’m here. Can you leave his contact info? And is it Jiang1 or Jiang4? A phone number would be good enough…I can read Chinese so I hope to have no problems finding the place.

By: Michael Max

Michael Max — Mon, 23 Nov 2009 00:13:42 +0000

He was giving about 3-4 gm’s per day. He would write up the ratio’s of what he wanted and then his “herb girls” would eyeball the amounts, stir up, and then toss it into the bagging machine. (they have these very nice Rube Goldberg machines that will take the granulated herbs and package them into easy to carry plastic bags that you just tear open)

By: Geoff Hudson

Geoff Hudson — Fri, 11 Sep 2009 17:00:54 +0000

I think you’ll find the honest skepticism here applies to people’s response to Western as well as Chinese medicine – which I like a lot (as opposed to sheep). Many of the ornery old buggers out in the country can be the best patients once you explain what is going on (which they aren’t used to from allopaths, and why compliance is low as well).

With Dr. Jiang’s formulas, would that be 4 to 5 gm total of the formulas (plus modifications) he wanted to prescribe, or of each he was giving (i.e., 1gm of qing bi tang, 1g xing su tang, etc to total 4-5g vs. 4-5g of qing bi, 4-5g of xing su, etc)?

Taiwanese politics is definitely entertaining, and occasionally a contact sport, as seen on TV!

By: Michael Max

Michael Max — Thu, 10 Sep 2009 17:38:46 +0000

@ Geoff Thanks, I’ve rather enjoyed working here in the Show-Me state. I’ve found a lot of openness to Chinese medicine and rather enjoy the honest skepticism that many people have. I’d much rather hear “Will this stuff really work?”, than “I believe in acupuncture.” Do come by should you make it here to the big city.

As to Doc Jiang’s formula. He would generally write it as 4 or 5 grams of whatever formula, followed by 2-3 grams of a single herb. His herb girls would take that multiply by 5 (People can get five days of granulated herbs as part of Taiwan’s national healthcare. Yes, they have a kick ass single payer single payer system AND they are a thriving democracy. Often with voter turnouts of 70% and above. Just in case you happen to think that single payer healthcare = socialism), then they would just eyeball the amounts and scoop up the granules with plastic spoons from some restaurant down the street. The herbs would then all be mixed together, and then put into a nifty machine that would seal them into individual packets, so people can easily carry their herbs around with them.

By: Geoff Hudson

Geoff Hudson — Thu, 10 Sep 2009 17:23:02 +0000

Hi Michael – welcome to Missouri. A friend of mine, Dave in Seattle, said you were moving to this neck of the woods. Did Dr. Jiang give a full dosage of the individual formulas or a small percentage of each to come up to the 10g tid (or whatever the ‘standard’ might be)?

By: Michael Max

Michael Max — Sun, 06 Sep 2009 21:16:17 +0000

Yes, that is pretty much it. What was surprising is how well it broke up dry phlegm.
It took me a while to grasp how he was using multiple formulas as a single entities in a prescription. I don’t think Jiang uses it as a shotgun approach, although it certainly looks that way on first glance. Like with any formula, the more precise we are with diagnosing the underlying patho-mechanism and crafting a prescription to fit it, the more effective the treatment will be.

It is very different from the way that Huang works. I use both methods. Both require precision. Both have their unique view of how to treat.

By: Dan Bensky

Dan Bensky — Sat, 05 Sep 2009 18:39:25 +0000

This kind of stuff is great! Let’s see if I have this correctly — something for cool-dryness, exterior cold with qi dynamic dysfunction, sinus congestion from a couple of perspectives, along with more for the exterior and for phlegm. Close?

By: Michael Max

Michael Max — Thu, 03 Sep 2009 15:33:38 +0000

Sure. It was a combination of:
xing su san
qing bi tang
xin yi san
shi shen tang
the five herbs mentioned in this posting
qian hu and chuan bei mu

wild, huh?